Ep 172: Stop Pushing PDFs, Start Hosting Panels | Expert Guest: Lisa Shaw

Download Lisa's LAUNCH framework.

We map a partner-led framework that turns original research into an event-first engine for trust, relevance, and pipeline. From picking credible partners to unveiling findings on expert panels, we show how one study can fuel a year of targeted, high-signal content.

• why original research beats AI‑generated content
• how to choose partners with shared ICP and credibility
• using customer language to shape survey topics
• assembling minimum viable assets during fielding
• unveiling insights on expert panels without your team
• small events as strong intent signals
• feedback loops via platforms and post‑event surveys
• nurturing with themes, tools, and persona content
• translating practitioner–executive language gaps
• co‑promotion across newsletters, Slack, and LinkedIn
• timing a yearly research cycle for maximum impact

It’s not if this episode made things feel a little more doable. I'd love to help you take the next step with the booked-out blueprint. It's a practical, low pressure session to clarify your offers, your marketing, and what actually moves the needle. You can book yours through the link in the show notes. You don't have to figure it out alone.

Meet Lisa Shaw

Lisa Shaw is the founder of Devon Point Group, where she partners with global technology brands on research-driven thought leadership programs. A former journalist turned content strategist, she combines deep analytical skills with storytelling to create high-impact marketing campaigns. Her team's work has earned recognition from the Web Marketing Association and HSMA. Lisa writes about B2B event marketing strategy at MarTech.org.

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Chapters

• 1:06 Setting The Show’s Mission
• 1:36 Introducing Original Research + Events
• 2:21 Guest Intro And Why Research Now
• 3:52 The Case For Partner-Led Credibility
• 5:21 What Makes A Good Partner
• 9:55 Use Customer Language, Not Jargon
• 10:53 Assemble Assets: Minimum Viable Content
• 14:18 Plan A Year Of Themes From Data
• 15:01 Unveil At Events With Expert Panels
• 18:50 Small Audiences, Big Intent Signals
• 22:57 Event Platforms And Instant Feedback
• 24:50 Nurture Continuously And Iterate
• 26:43 It Works Virtual And In Person
• 29:29 Co‑Promotion With Community Partners
• 32:43 Harvest Insights And Bridge Gaps
• 37:43 Timing Your Annual Research Launch
• 40:06 Where To Find The Framework And CTA

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:34

Welcome to Marketing. I'm Sarah No Block. This show is made for solo consultants who want to get booked out without burning out. If you've ever thought, I just want this to feel easier, you're not alone. Around here, we focus on simple, sustainable growth that actually fits into your life so growth feels doable instead of overwhelming. I'm gonna take my shoes off, relax a little bit, settle right in. There we go. Um, okay, I'm really excited about this topic because I so we're talking today about original research and tying it into events, an event first strategy with that. And I haven't seen that before. So when I was looking at your form, I was like, ooh, I'm gonna learn a lot today.

SPEAKER_01: 1:23

Yes, it's just a different channel and it's just a way to make the research more of an experience, like more 3D rather than something flat.

SPEAKER_00: 1:34

Yeah, that's a whole different way than like I work with a decent amount of original researchers, and I haven't seen anybody apply it in this way. So before we get into all of that, can you introduce yourself to the audience?

SPEAKER_01: 1:48

Yes, absolutely. I'm Lisa Shaw. I'm the founder of Devon Point. Um, my company works it's a small content strategy practice. My company works with um B2B tech founders and B2B technology companies. We focus mostly on original content. So my background is in journalism. I still write for more tech on event marketing. And one of the most important things that companies can focus on right now is the kind of content that AI can't reproduce. So by definition, event sessions, subject matter expert interviews, and original research are areas that it literally hasn't happened yet. So no LLMs can train on it.

SPEAKER_00: 2:33

Yeah. That's where I'm focused, right? That's that's brilliant. That is absolutely brilliant. So similar thought process where it's like anything that AI can't do or replicate is where you need to focus because then you can use AI to make like to expand on whatever it is or repurpose whatever it is that you're creating, but create something original first because then that can't be duplicated. There is no original thought in AI. So I love this angle. Can you walk me through how to tie original research to an event? Absolutely. So I have a whole framework for it. Oh, I love the framework.

SPEAKER_01: 3:16

And we all do. Every, every small marketer needs them. And you know, you do such a great job of bringing those resources to our community of small marketing teams where we are always stretched for resources, right? So yes, original research is one of those things where you think, oh, I really need a big team or I really need a big budget. And that's why this framework is organized this way. Because no, I'm gonna show you that you do not. Um, what you meet are friends, partners. And the partners are the focus. The partners are people that you work with for credibility and reach. And then they also are kind of the the cornerstone of the of the event process. So I'll start. If you want me to start to talk about the framework, I can't.

SPEAKER_00: 4:07

Yeah, I'm dying. I'm dying to know. Like I'm I love partnerships. Go on.

SPEAKER_01: 4:12

Yeah, so awesome. So research, the the framework is is called Blanche, and it's based on um leading with partners. That's the L in the framework. Lead with your partners. You really need to get your partners on board, and they're the ones who are going to be guiding the research because they're the ones who are close to the community. They're the ones who know where the pain points are, they're the ones who know really intimately their membership because they are there to serve their membership. Um, and you're like, okay, partners, how do you find partners, right?

SPEAKER_00: 4:49

I was literally going to say, let's pause and let's talk about like what makes a good partner. Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 4:55

So what makes a good partner? Somebody in your space, right? So when you think about partners, credibility and reach, you want to be able to partner with some organization that is already has your ICP in it, right? People who are going to benefit from the survey that you're doing or the research that you're doing, and also be an audience for you when you want to talk to them after the survey research is published. So chances are very good. Many companies have organizations that they partner with already. Um and you may have them, your executives may have them. Um, but if you don't, you know, you there's somewhere between 60 and 80,000 professional organizations in the United States. Those organizations serve members. And if they are in your industry or in your vertical, they would be great partners because they're focused on member services and you are focused on getting research that you can then repurpose in your marketing. Um, one of the other really great ways to find a good partner is something that you talk about in your masterclass and in a podcast. In niche communities, right? You go, I know, right? So quality over quantity, every time. If you get a few hundred really qualified respondents and a few hundred really qualified people, those are a good pipeline. Even if it's not thousands, they're really qualified and they're showing intense signals. So that's where we focus. That's why this is number one leading with the partners is so important.

SPEAKER_00: 6:34

Okay, let's pause before we move to A. Okay. Um, so with the partnerships, you're looking for someone who has the same ICP as you so they can get them to participate in the survey. So you have their data, but you can also then share that survey result with those communities. And so you kind of have a leg up on whatever content you create from that research. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 7:09

And they are also making sure that your survey topics are credible, right? So you want to make sure that what you're doing research on is not just self-serving. You really need you need to go into this in the in this frame, you know, frame of mind that you're going to create a piece of research that is not going to be talking about your company, but that you have leverage to talk about your company in a way that people who are who this topic resonates with will understand, right? You are going to go in as a thought leader at that moment. So that's why partnership is so important because they have the access and they have the credibility with those communities.

SPEAKER_00: 7:55

Yeah, it is pretty ick when you're seeing something come out and it's just about the company. Like, what am I supposed to do with this?

SPEAKER_01: 8:03

How do I apply this? Right. And as marketers, right, we have what um Hemingway called built-in BS detectors, right? That's true. We can smell it. We know we're living that life. We totally do. And it the mint, so here's a really good example of that. So for one of the projects that I did for a client, we got 83% of our responses came from our partner communities. Like we probably should have gotten this, but people weren't interested because it was a it was a we're a vendor, right? This client was a vendor and they they weren't trusting it. But when it came from their community, people were really interested in the topic because it was more credible. And one of the things that we did during planning of that research, we were using a term that the community did not use to describe themselves. And if we didn't have the partner to give us that insight, we would have gone out there with that like clunky term that would have turned people off immediately.

SPEAKER_00: 8:59

Yeah, that's such a good point. And you can pull that tip into absolutely everything. If you're using jargon or phrase that you specifically use because you don't know what they use in their life or their job, it's gonna ring that spell for them because they're like, you're not one of us. Exactly. Exactly. And they know, right? Yeah, they know. Um, real quick before we move to the A, one thing that you can do, so not you, but you as the listener can do to make sure that you're using the right phrasing that your clients use is to pull the transcripts from your sales calls and the meetings that you have with them. And you can throw those transcripts into ChatGPT and ask, like, how does my ideal customer talk about X, whatever it is you're doing the research on? And you can find the specific words because you're using their transcript that they use, and then just mirror that description. That is a great use of Chat GPT. Um, yeah, transcripts plus chat GPT makes me very happy. And then this is okay. Now we can move to now we're ready. Now we're ready.

SPEAKER_01: 10:20

Now we're ready. So A is for assemble assets, right? So the assets are everything. It's what your company is gonna use to build on this research. And while the research is in the field, you have to be making a plan, especially if you're a really small team, which most of your listeners are. Um, you need a plan. So you're gonna be putting together your assets. You you have to figure out, okay, what's my minimum viable content plan? Right. The minimum viable content plan is number one, the re the research report. I where is it gonna live? Is it gonna live on your website? Is it gonna be a PDF? Is it gonna be on a Notion page? Are you gonna gate it? How are you gonna gate it? Like all of those things you have to figure that out. Do you have the resources for design, right? So that's another expense. If you have the resources to do that, great. If not, you can create, maybe you can work with um a graphic artist just to create some of the data visualizations that are gonna be the foundation of your marketing, right? So that'll be a great investment. Um, once you've figured out where your report is going to live and whether or not it's going to be gated. So do you need a landing page? Do you need an inertian page? The next thing you need are a couple of blogs. Number one is the blog that's gonna basically encapsulate all of the research bindings. This is gonna be the number one piece that will have all of the charts and all of the analysis. It's gonna be your long form piece and you're gonna pull from. Um, make sure you have another blog on deck. And there are so many different ways to repurpose um research. And you can figure out is it gonna be something that you're gonna target to a particular member of your audience? So, you know, so that you have that to lead with. The next thing that you need to have is a webinar deck because remember, we're leading with the event. So you're gonna pull all of that together into a deck, and you're gonna be using those charts and those graphs from the research project, and they're gonna put those in a deck so that you're ready to go. Those graphics and those infographics, they're gonna be a key part of the next one, which is a social carousel, right? So all of the key findings will go in the social carousel. And then finally, the best thing that I recommend is having a lead magnet. When you go to an event, everybody likes to have it downloadable, like a little something extra, right? So you feel like, okay, I was heard and this is awesome, and I'm gonna get this nice little gift. Um, so all of that has to be done in advance, right? So that when you have your event, you're you're gonna launch, you're gonna be ready to go. So during this couple of months, so the surveys in the field, maybe six weeks, right? So you've got a couple of months of planning time that you need to put in and you're gonna put together a plan, a plan of assets and a timeline and your minimum viable content, you know, put it all, pull all of those things together so that once the research does start coming in, you can you can pull it all together and say, okay, did what we expect from the beginning actually happen, right? Where are our hypotheses validated? What does the research actually show? Are we going to be able to tell the stories that we thought we were going to be able to tell in our planning meetings? So that's gonna give you a good framework. So you're going out, you have some assets ready, you have a calendar so that you have a monthly kind of an idea of what you're gonna be talking about month to month because you want to make this stretch out for a year. You want a full year of content from this. So you have your themes, right? Every month is gonna be a theme. And now you've got this whole plan. It's already laid out. You don't have everything filled in yet because you're gonna let the data do the talking. So now you're ready. You're ready, you've got everything in place, and you're ready for your you. Are we ready to move on? I am. Okay, so you is for unveil, and we're unveiling the research at our events, and the research becomes a shared experience. And here's where we go back to our partners again. Your partners have relationships with the people who have taken your survey. They are influencers in their field or they're experts in their field, and they are going to be on your panel. This webinar is going to be them talking about the research in ways that only they can. The most importantly interesting to remember is who is not on the panel is you. Nobody from your company is on that panel because that's an instant drop in credibility, right? You don't want to be there. You are the thought leader behind it. You funded it, right? You are just as interested in the results from this research as anybody else. But if you put yourself on that panel, you automatically taint the credibility of the research. So that's the hardest thing. It's the hardest thing. Yeah, companies, right? That is the hardest thing. And I think that getting buy-in from an executive, I think that the the companies that I have worked with show a lot of faith because the executives are like, yeah, I can see that, but they have to understand why that's important. Because the research by itself is not going to promote your company. It's what you do with it afterwards. And the more credible it is and the more it resonates with the communities that you're trying to reach, the better able you'll be able to use that and repurpose that content afterwards, right?

SPEAKER_00: 17:13

Yeah, that makes complete sense. I so now that you're walking me through it, I'm picturing this as probably more of like a mid-sized company that's doing this if they are funding the research and then having the um the influencers on the panel. It would be less someone who's like a tiny business, like a solo business. They're not going to be funding something like this. They'll probably be participating. Right. One of the survey participants, maybe.

SPEAKER_01: 17:50

Or they could team up with others in the industry and do a survey that benefits all of them, right? By definition. Yeah, like a group. Yeah. Exactly. Because by definition, the survey is agnostic. The topics are topics that people in the community are interested in. And then each one of the participants and each one of the funders can then use that research to their own benefit. It doesn't have to be a big company, right? It can be a smaller company because remember, the partners that you're that you're working with, you're not paying, right? Yeah. They're getting the research. They're getting the end. Exactly. Exactly. You're organizing it and they're getting the research. So that's a value add for their membership, right? It's the very definition of a win-win. And who doesn't like a good win-win?

SPEAKER_00: 18:41

Um, I do. I love that. And I think that makes so much sense though. Like for maybe people who are listening who are solo consultants, if you team up with other solo consultants that are going after the same ICP as you or dream client, um, that way you can get research that you can leverage for your own business, but you're also sharing the workload. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 19:07

So one of my clients, they had they had a couple of partners that worked with them on research. So they did a couple of webinars because each one of their communities wanted to have their own, right? They wanted to have their own experts and their own people on the panel. So we did a couple of launches with that particular research project. And each one of those webinars only had 200 people register and maybe 40 to 50 people show. So it was really small, but those audiences were, those were intent signals, right? Those audiences were locked into that research. They were, they were, they were ready for it, right? They were ready for the follow-up that came afterwards because they had already expressed this is this is a serious pain point. And they heard that reflected back at them in the webinar. They heard it from experts they already trusted. So when we followed up, when the client followed up afterwards with, hey, we noticed this was an issue for you, they were ready. They were primed because we already heard their voices. So the webinar itself doesn't have to be hundreds and hundreds of people if those people are really um targeted in your ICP.

SPEAKER_00: 20:24

Yeah. And I personally do not care about the size of how many people are at an event. It's who is at the event. Is it the right people in the room? Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 20:36

Exactly. So one of the other things that came from most of the um webinars, you do the satisfaction studies afterwards, right? The survey, how did you like this? And some of this, some of the some of these events become so popular that people are so gratified, right? That they're that they, oh wow, my pain point was reflected back and these people get me. I it's so exciting to hear this. Like these people are in the trenches every day. Um, we get great feedback, quality feedback, and we can use those quotes in social campaigns, which is another smart, right? It's just another source of just another source of great content.

SPEAKER_00: 21:18

Quick question What event platform do you use for this where you get feedback right away?

SPEAKER_01: 21:24

So um my partners that work on the platforms. Some of them are using Goldcast. Some of them are using Rev. I don't I don't know the tech stacks of all the different partners because we don't using different ones. They're all using different ones. Yes. I'm trying to remember some of the ones, but those are the two that popped out.

SPEAKER_00: 21:50

I had someone from Goldcast on the show before. I see they're great. Yeah. Um, so for the little guys who are watching this, you can get automatic feedback using platforms like Demio or Butter. So those are two that I know that are interactive event platforms that also automatically request feedback from attendees.

SPEAKER_01: 22:18

I have actually been on an event with a on the Butter platform, and it's really good. It's it's easy.

SPEAKER_00: 22:25

Yes, I used Butter for a long time. It got a little glitchy to the point where I was like, I can't use this until the glitches are fixed because it would like bounce me out as the host. I have like 50 problems a lot. I'm like fix this and I'll come back because everything else I loved.

SPEAKER_01: 22:48

Oh, that sounds so cringe. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00: 22:51

Oh my god. I got so lucky though, because I had some attendees there that are friends of mine and just stepped up and like talked until I was able to get back in. Yeah. Okay. Go on. Okay. We're on. We're ready.

SPEAKER_01: 23:11

So the end is for nurture and nurture continuously, right? So remember, we we blocked out our plan. We have our month-to-month um themes, right? So we we've already launched with our minimum viable content plan. And now we're going, we're not doing any random publishing. We we have a plan, but we're going to use engagement metrics to figure out what are we going to publish next? Because this research now is an endless source of great content. How are we going to produce it? What channels are people responding in? And where do we need to go next? So infographics, right? Checklists, so many different ways that you can repurpose that. For one of my clients, I did an interactive tool. And this was really cool because it was a really low lift for their little team. It had we just everybody is such a small team. We have so many things that we have to do. But we were able to pull together this interacted tool using type form that drilled down on a pain point that people were coming back and saying, oh my gosh, this is so huge. We could see it in the engagement with some of the blogs. We could see it in some of the comments. And that's what we did. So this tool was a self-assessment. Like, where do you really land? How is this affecting you and your work? And it was a simple, I think maybe seven or eight question self-assessment, but it was such a huge, huge thing. It became the number one driver for this client's amazing demo request. That was awesome. I know it was smooth. So just this one thing that we produced from a survey became this interactive tool that they now use for their other campaigns. People are really excited because they answer these questions, they get some instant answers. And then when the company decided to use it for other campaigns, they had additional downloads from the company's own white papers and, you know, other resources. Brilliant. It was awesome. It was a really great thing. So nurturing continuously is the way to go and letting the um letting the data inform your next plan for what you're going to do for your next piece of content.

SPEAKER_00: 25:33

This is so intriguing. So when I saw events and research, I was like, how do you do an in-person event based around research? But your panel idea, like it would work in-person, virtual, anything. I don't know why my mind automatically went to in-person. Do not know because the vast majority of the events I attend are online. But your panel idea is so smart because then people are giving feedback and their observations around the research that was pulled out from that and what they learned. For sure.

SPEAKER_01: 26:13

But you know what? It also works in person. So for one of the events that were one of the research projects that I did, one of the events that this research was used in was an in-person event. One of the partners decided this research was so resonant with their community that they they stood up a whole session at their in-person event around the research. So we weren't necessarily there. We weren't on that panel either, but it just expanded the reach. And of course, the client's name was all over the research because, you know, they funded it.

SPEAKER_00: 26:51

So okay, hold on. I got an idea too. Um the in-person conferences that are related to what your research is. Like, couldn't someone come in as like who is a panelist on one of your webinars as a keynote speaker and talk through those data points. Yeah. Like there's so much you can do to expand the reach using leveraging other people's events too.

SPEAKER_01: 27:16

Absolutely. And that's where the partners come in, right? You know, you just need that reach. And again, if the survey was done properly and designed well and it's good quality data, people want good information, right? It's it it resonates with a whole bunch of different audiences. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 27:38

Yeah, makes complete sense. Did that rebuff launch? Like, was was are we on our H? No, we have one more letter of a. Okay, that's what I thought.

SPEAKER_01: 27:53

We are co-promoting now. We are co-promoting with our partners. And what we were just talking about, right? The events where you could use this research and in person, it kind of goes along with this. So your partners have access to channels that you don't right. They have subscribers. Maybe they have a newsletter. So their subscribers get the newsletter every month or every week. You can talk about the research in there. The partners can. Um, they have LinkedIn DMs and they have their own um, their own contacts on LinkedIn. They also have private Slack communities where they are always talking about different things. And they can research. I know, me too. And they can bring the research to the private Slack communities. And everywhere they go, they are bringing good quality research that people have already expressed interest in. And the client's name is attached to that research, right? So, what is the statistic that 95% of your customers are not actually going to buy from you right now? That you need to be, you need to be thinking about thought leadership. You need to be thinking about brand. And this is the way to do that by working with people who are credible in your industry and putting your name behind good quality research that just can't be reproduced anywhere else. So you give the partners what you're doing, right? You've you've now you've already got your months planned out and you're giving them everything that you produce. Okay, if you're doing if you're looking at the research differently, or maybe you're running the cross tabs differently, or maybe you have new um data visualizations. You're sharing all of that with your partners, right? They they may or may not use it, but at least they know what your month's theme is and where you're going and what part of the market you're gonna be, what you're gonna be talking about with your part of the market. Um for one project that I did, the partner hosted the research on their website. We got a fair number of downloads from ours, but there were two and a half times the number of downloads of that research from the partner site just because they're they're more credible. They're their community's already there and already comfortable with them. So we saw a huge number of leads come from that because the partners, their partners are part of the research. They're they're really credible.

SPEAKER_00: 30:12

Yeah, you're probably like, yes, please, continue. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 30:16

Exactly. Right, Coke. Yeah, I I get your point about how this may not be feasible for a really, really small like solopreneur. Um, but there are possibilities, right?

SPEAKER_00: 30:29

It just stretches so far. Yes, doing this one project feeds your content and your lead generation for an entire year. Yes. So while I think it's possible, like your idea if you partner with other solo consultants. Um, I think that this would work really well, though, for a small team if they have an outside partner running the research. Yeah, for sure. Okay, now we're at H.

SPEAKER_01: 31:04

H is for harvest insights, right? So the numbers are great. We all are looking for data, and the numbers are great, but only if they make us smarter. So what we're gonna be tracking, we're gonna be tracking the same thing that we do for any content or any content campaign. We're gonna track opens, we're gonna track downloads, we're gonna look at our qualitative replies to the webinars, and then we're gonna think about what is it that has resonated the most with people and what can we now produce to scratch that itch. Um, what are we uh what are we looking at? So we've got a plan, but the actual tactic um uh uh implementation of that plan is gonna happen in this phase where we're thinking about, okay, uh one of the examples that happened. So uh in one of the webinars that we ran, uh it turned out that this there was this pain point in in the industry. However, uh the two different stakeholders within the community were talking about it very differently. Uh one of them was was the practitioner level, right? They were thinking of it as, you know, from a technology perspective. And the other stakeholders were the C level, and they were reporting back to their boards and they were thinking about big picture stuff. They could not, they did not have the language to talk to their teams about what their concerns were. And the teams were so frustrated because they would bring their concerns to the executives and they weren't heard because they weren't using language that the executives understood. So we saw that mismatch in communication, and we developed a blog series, how to talk to your executives about pain point. And the executives, we had how to talk to your team or how to get more from your team around pain point.

SPEAKER_00: 33:00

And we watched pain point AI. It was not the thing is right. I have so many clients where that is what they're talking about.

SPEAKER_01: 33:13

It's well, everyone is talking about it now. But this would no, this was about data quality, right? And it does actually inform in AI because it's garbage in, garbage out. When you're working in technology, you know that anything you feed a system is just gonna chuck it right back at you. And if it's garbage data, you're gonna get garbage back. So this was a concern for everybody, right? Everybody was concerned about the poor quality data, but the tech, the tech teams were dealing with the actual data. And the executives were like, what is it telling us and what how can we fix it? And they don't they don't want to talk about the technology. So we were we were giving the the um the practitioner teams the actual language to use. If you have this problem, here's how you want to talk about it with your executive. Or if you have this problem, this is the language that your executive will respond to. And it was, it still is the number one most viewed blog on the client site. And the executive, I mean, even though the blog didn't reach as many executives, that's the number seven. I mean, it's just to this day, it's number seven.

SPEAKER_00: 34:22

Yeah, and it wasn't even intended for the executives. It was supporting people who are working with them.

SPEAKER_01: 34:28

Exactly. Exactly. So that's just one example of how to repurpose and and how to how to use the insights from the data to inform your plan for content.

SPEAKER_00: 34:40

Yeah. Yeah, and that really does like take it in a whole other direction. You're they used it to rethink how to talk internally too.

SPEAKER_01: 34:53

Exactly. And it gets them, you know, it get it gets them on a little bit closer, right? Where they're all working toward the same goal. And sometimes those communication gaps really prevent people from moving things forward.

SPEAKER_00: 35:09

Yeah. And often there's just a different perspective. So while you may agree, it's just not your top priority because an executive is going to have a different, bigger problem than the tech people. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 35:24

They usually do. So that's it. That is the launch framework. It basically the H part is what makes it repeatable. It which it's what makes it a system. Um, and then, you know, if if it resonated and the partners were happy, then you can do it all again the following year.

SPEAKER_00: 35:40

Yes. So quick question before we wrap up. I know we're at time, at least on the podcast time of things. Um, when is the best time to launch research? Like, is the is there a seasonality to it where people are looking for it more often than uh than others?

SPEAKER_01: 36:02

I think a lot of this stuff starts at the beginning of the year, right? That's when we see the 2026 survey of X, Y, and Z, right?

SPEAKER_00: 36:10

That was my gut, but I'm not in the research game. So I wasn't sure.

SPEAKER_01: 36:14

No, that's pretty much where most of my clients land. They want to kick off the new year with, you know, a look at this or that or the other thing or insights and something to inform their content plan and their marketing, their go-to-market plan for the rest of the year and having that research to kick them off is a really good, a really good way to start.

SPEAKER_00: 36:36

So based off of the timeline that you were giving me earlier, they should probably be ready to start the research in like September minimum. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 36:49

September, where you're talking about your partner, talking to your partners and making sure that you're aligned with them and everybody's happy about the the plan and then fielding it in October or November, maybe, maybe even, you know, you're going to market in February. Maybe you're launching and you're gonna bypass that whole beginning first month of January we're we're talking about. Not quite working yet. Exactly. Where we're too busy being bombarded with come back to the gym message.

SPEAKER_00: 37:18

Yeah, my kids don't go back to school until mid-January. So I'm useless until mid-January.

SPEAKER_01: 37:25

Exactly. I think a lot of people are the same. So, you know, there's nothing wrong with kicking off, you know, February 1st. And here we go. That's the true new year. Really is. It really is.

SPEAKER_00: 37:37

Thank you so much for joining me today. Can you tell the audience how they can find you, work with you, where you hang out online?

SPEAKER_01: 37:46

Absolutely. So I am at devonpoint.com. And once we're finished here, I am going to put a copy of the launch framework on my website for your listeners at devonpoint.com forward slash tiny marketing so that they can access that. Um, I am I'm actually planning right now with my research partner for 2026. So we're hoping to have more resources for people to download for you know for next year. Um, a lot of people are interested in original research now. The more, what is it, work slop, I think is the new word that I produce. Um, the more people are looking for ways to differentiate. And I think original research is going to be one of those ways. So we're trying to get ahead of that and produce resources for people to really understand what is involved in doing a project and and how they can get started.

SPEAKER_00: 38:41

I love that. And I think it's brilliant. We all have to think about one, like what tech is happening right now, and two, what the economy looks like and adjust our offers accordingly, like what makes sense today and always be ready to adapt. The quick changers, the people who adapt fast, they're the ones that stick around.

SPEAKER_01: 39:02

Absolutely. And I think to your point earlier, I think that's one of the reasons why smaller teams are actually making faster headway with AI. Um, just because they they're already accustomed to adapting very, very quickly to change.

SPEAKER_00: 39:16

True. And less red tape too. The less people have to sign off on everything that you're doing. 100%. That's why I always liked small teams.

SPEAKER_01: 39:24

I know. So much more agile. And if you see something is not working, you can pivot right away. Yes. Or double down on the stuff that is.

SPEAKER_00: 39:32

Lesson learned, goodbye. That's exactly. Exactly. Yeah, that's why I always say marketing is an experiment. It doesn't matter if it fails. That was a learning lesson. So you know how to make that like what didn't work. Cut that, try something else.

SPEAKER_01: 39:47

Absolutely. In technology, what we say is to fail faster, right?

SPEAKER_00: 39:52

Yeah, they say the same thing in startups. Fail fast, make a pivot. Not a big deal. Laugh for me. It's not if this episode made things feel a little more doable. I'd love to help you take the next step with the booked out blueprint. It's a practical, low pressure session to clarify your offers, your marketing, and what actually moves the needle. You can book yours through the link in the show notes. You don't have to figure it out alone.